AN INTERVIEW WITH BARR. NDABAI THELMA ON THE DIGNITY OF WOMEN AND CHILDREN IN THE SOCIETY

There is no gainsaying that there are no vulnerable groups in our society. Often, we read or watch our women and children treated as “it”. This goes a long way to dehumanize and de-dignify this group. It is in the light of this that Women Aid Collective (WACOL)–– a Non Governmental Organization–– works tirelessly without minding the odds to recover the dignity of this group. SPEAK MAGAZINE while speaking for the poor and the vulnerable groups deems it a duty to have an audience with Barrister Ndabai Thelma, the head of Legal Unit of WACOLWho are those that can come to your office for help? In other words, what is the work of your agency?
We see to the welfare of vulnerable groups in Nigeria, especially women and children like widows who are oppressed; children in conflict with the law, women having marital problems and the like. We make sure that children who are abused are properly taken care of and treated accordingly. There are many units in WACOL, but these are some of the issues we handle in our Legal Unit.
What do you actually understand by the phrase: “the dignity of women and children”

The meaning of that phrase is the pride of women and children. The pride of a woman is to be treated fairly as a woman, and that of the child is to be treated justly as a child. My pride are the things people ought to respect in me, and what I hold so dearly. Education, for instance, can be one’s pride.

What can you say are the factors that promote the dignity of women and children in Nigeria?
There are federal, state and cultural laws that protect women and children in our society and promote their dignity. The 1999 Constitution, Convention of the Right of the Child, The Child Right Act, The Child Right Law and the like, are in place for such duty. In Enugu State and in some other states, there is a law on ‘The Prohibition of Infringement of a Widow’s And Widower’s Fundamental Rights” enacted by the Enugu State House of Assembly on March 8, 2001. There are many unwritten laws in our different cultures that also go a long way to protecting and promoting the dignity of women and children. These statutes are there to promote the dignity of these groups.

Can you name some practices that infringe on the dignity of women and children in the society?
There are so many practices in our society that infringe on their dignity. Such practices include female gender mutilation (women circumcision), disinheritance (widows deprived of their late husbands’ property), wife inheritance, belief that girl-child does not matter in the family but the boy child does, and the refusal to send women to school as their male counterpart because of the belief that their training would not benefit the family, but the would-be-husband’s. However the situation of the last points is now reducing than it was in olden days. If you don’t educate a girl-child as her male counterpart, it is an infringement on her right to education. Some widows who have no male child have suffered from their husbands’ relatives in the sense that their belongings are taken away from them since they have no right to own anything as these cultures claim. Men abusing women and violence against women such as battering (domestic violence) are infringements which section 35 of the 1999 Constitution condemns, while promoting the dignity of women. The 1999 Constitution, which every other constitution in Nigeria is subject to, makes it clear that everyone has right to own movable or immovable property. The idea that women cannot own anything is a serious crime on the dignity of women. Sad enough is to know that in some cultures, women are considered, as chattels. Such things as the woman must drink the water used in bathing the corpse of the husband, or the woman must sleep with the corpse of her husband are terrible acts against womanhood. In some offices, women are not allowed to be first in command. These are some of the practices that infringe on women’s and children’s dignity.

How do you handle such cases you listed above paying particular attention to relevant traditional practices?
We follow the law, and there are laws in place to deal with these abnormally. The problem we have is that many a woman do not like to come out and share their problems with us. However, we keep on looking for scape-goats to use in implementing these laws which are already in place. A woman must give her consent, if any of her husband’s property is to be used by another. If this is not done and it is found out, the offender is brought to book and proper punishment meted out to him. If report of any of the infringements comes to our desk, we charge the offender to court, and the law takes its course. There are number of years each offence requires in prison when it is established.
Section 36 of the Criminal Code, and also the Evident Act, declare that a man and his wife are one. Whatever belongs to the man belongs to his wife. However, the law goes down in section 253 of the same Criminal Code to see both as no more one once there is violence or assault on any of the partners by the other partner. So, assault is a criminal offence. Once a woman is battered by the husband and the report reaches us, we would get the man arrested and then let the law take its course. The issue of the couple being one does not arise here anymore since assault is in the shadow. We get the police involved in such a criminal case, and then charge the matter to court.
In children for example, child abuse is a big offence. Children are also battered. For instance, there are cases where women batter children, especially their maids and the bruises are evident. Once the report reaches us, we get the woman or any offenders arrested and detained in police net, and charge it to court allowing the law to take its pound of flesh. It is now a criminal offence to refuse your child right to education. One who refuses his or her child education is liable to some years of imprisonment. If such as case of a parent not sending his/her child to school comes to us, I write to the police or go in person to let them know that such is a criminal offence and they get the parent(s) arrested. Under the Convention of the Rights of a Child and the Child Right Act, it is the child’s right to be educated, and you infringe on it when you don’t send the child to school. We are not pleading with the parents to send their children to school. What we are declaring is that they must send them to school because it is their right. The children are not begging their parents for this; they only claim it as their right. We have dealt with these cases and many others, and we get positive results.

You talked of a child claiming its right to education. Supposing the parents are poor and unable to cater for the financial involvement; what would be the course of action here?
Thank God that there is free education. Many government primary and secondary schools around us offer education free of charge. What we are saying is that parents should give their children the opportunity for basic education. Although, education is becoming expensive today; nonetheless they have to be given at least the basics.

There are cases that need urgent attention. Do you brace up to this challenge when such cases are brought to your agency for attention?
Delays in cases in court are not caused by the court, but by the lawyer either the prosecution lawyer (plaintiff) or the defendant. It is the lawyer, not the court. Whenever any of them is not prompt, they keep on seeking adjournment for some reasons, which are not sometimes genuine. One of the reasons can be for financial gain. They know that any time they appear in court they are sure of some pay from their client, and thus they keep on requesting adjournment frequently. I for one, if I want to get my case moving especially when it requires urgency, I speak to the other lawyer in the other part to try to be prompt. It is when the lawyer is not prompt that the idea of delay arises. So, the blame for the delay goes to the lawyers and not the court.
Our method here is first come first serve. As you come, you fill a form. It is not all cases that we sit down here to determine. We write to the police to take urgent action on a particular case that needs urgent attention when it has to be with a criminal case. We refer all criminal cases to the police and it is only the police that can prosecute such a case. We work hand in hand with them. We can only prosecute a criminal case when we obtain the Attorney-General’s fiat. Assault for one is a criminal case. When such a case comes, we immediately write to the police and even petition the commissioner of police for urgent action. We handle civil cases without seeking police attention. We handle such case as tenant refusing to park out, and other civil cases.

Do you assist those who are poor and are victimized, but do not have the financial strength to pursue a legal course.
At WACOL, you don’t need money to do your case. We don’t collect a dime for whatever. It is a charity organization. In the police station for cases of crime, you equally don’t need money. The police are paid for the job by the government, and should not demand anything from anybody. If a policeman or woman demands money from you for anything, you have to refuse giving him/her but write to the DPO or the Commissioner of Police explaining the situation.

How do you fare financially in this humanitarian service? Are you supported by any group or government?
There are some organizations that are interested in what we do. They do give us some money in showing appreciation and supporting the work we do in fighting for the rights of women and children. The government does not fund our organization. They can only call us for some workshops if they like, but not funding.

Can men who are victimized by women or fellow men still come to your agency for assistance?
A man oppressed by his fellow man should know how to fight for himself. Men come to report to us about their wives or other women victimizing them. We do handle such cases here, but not that of a man and another man.

Do you advertise your agency? And why are many Nigerians ignorant of the nature and scope of your work, if you agree with me.
We normally run community workshops, and we have community law centres in some rural villages. We invite the “Igwes” of different communities in such workshops. These traditional rulers continue to disseminate the information they acquired during the workshops among their subjects after the workshops. Some time we sponsor jingles on the air for those who have access to electronic media.

What are your major setbacks?
Sometimes taking care of your own family does constitute a set back. Other times, we don’t have the funding to really push a particular case the way we would like to push it. The funding doesn’t come all the time. We struggle so hard to make sure that we are standing, especially the legal unit that has made impact in so many lives. Sometimes, the women would bring cases, and we fight tooth and nail to make sure that justice is won, but we see them sometimes shrinking back while the cases are still in progress. You hear them saying that they would rather be with their husbands even if they are being beaten or killed by them, than allowing their husbands be arrested by the police. Some would be begging you to leave their husbands when you must have arrested them. Sometimes, it may seem discouraging, but we have never allowed such to weigh us down and be discouraged. It is by the grace of God that we are still standing as we run around.

What are your last words to the public?
It is from the home that problems crop up. Parents should teach their children what they ought to know for good character, and send them to school. Parents should cut down on their anger, because almost all ills we handle here, especially domestic violence, are the resultant effects of anger. Children are destroyed when they watch their mother being battered/ beaten by their father and vice versa. Women, however, should remain in their matrimonial homes, because some of the children that are destroyed come from broken homes. Parents also should not contribute negatively to the problem of their children who are already married, especially in encouraging them to abandon their husbands and then be harboured by them (their parents). Remain in your marriage, and try to make it work. Above all, ask God for direction because he never disappoints, and he can never disappoint you.



CHILD ABUSE AND TRAFFICKING IN WOMEN AND CHILDREN
The curiosity of humanitarian organizations world-wide has been attracted by the increase in child abuse and trafficking in women. It is awful to note that some money mongers are embarking on human trafficking as their only source of income and survival. In this interview, SPEAK MAGAZINE, the mouthpiece of the poor, has singled out one of these organizations (NAPTIP) to expose, challenge and consequently cub this menace. Here is our interview with Mrs Ijeoma Okonkwo, Head, Enugu Zonal Office of NAPTIP
Excerpt:
What is the full meaning of NAPTIP?
It is the National Agency for the Prohibition of Trafficking in Persons and Other Related Matters. It is set up by the Federal Government through an act known as Trafficking In Persons, Prohibition, Law Enforcement And Administration Act. This act was passed into law in July 2003, and was amended in Dec. 2005.

What are the activities of this agency?
She fights against human trafficking. Our activities include law enforcement and administration of this Act. To carry these out, NAPTIP is empowered by the law to arrest, investigate and prosecute human trafficking and child abuse offenders. We are also empowered to take victims of human trafficking, those exploited and abused for counseling, to shelter them, rehabilitate and integrate them into the society again. We also carry out public enlightenment and other activities centering on elimination of human trafficking. We are equally empowered by the law to collaborate with other agencies, and work in other ministries to ensure the elimination of human trafficking and child abuse.

When we talk of child abuse and trafficking in woman and children, what do we actually mean?
These are two different issues. One is child abuse and the other is trafficking in women and children. Though different, they are closely related. Trafficking in a nutshell is the recruitment, the movement of people from one place to another, perhaps within the same community or outside their community by means of deceit, being lured away from home by force or other means employed in moving somebody from her immediate environment to another for the purpose of exploitation and selfish gain. When you have this in place, we can now talk about human trafficking. We talk more of women and child trafficking because trafficking as a crime trades on the vulnerable. It is easier to trick, lure, or deceive people who are vulnerable into compromising their safety and their persons. When you look at the class of people who are more prone to trafficking you notice that they are mostly women and children–– children because they cannot take their own decision; women more often because they are poorer. They are move vulnerable; they are the weaker ones and most of the time a lot of them are not exposed to education and to decent means of livelihood. A lot of child abuses take place right within the child’s immediate community where otherwise the child should feel comfortable, while in trafficking, a child has to be taken away. Ultimately there is abuse in trafficking because this child that has been taken away from its community will eventually get abused and exploited. So abuse is simply exploiting one who is in a vulnerable state, to expose such a person to the situations that are not in consonance with his well-being. When a child is taken into a situation where its well-being, health, sexuality, and labour are manipulated to the extent that this child’s well-being is compromised, then, we can rightly say that this child has been abused. The big difference I want to point out is that abuse can take place irrespective of trafficking, whereas trafficking cannot take place without abuse. Ultimately trafficking fuels abuse in children.

Don’t you think that poverty does cause some parents and guardians of the victims consent to their being abused or trafficked?
In most cases, yes is the answer. I was going through one website on the internet shortly before you came in, and the scenario displayed was the case of a man who gave out his 10 or 11 year-old son to a trusted person believing that the child would be well taken care of. So you see in that case the parents and the guardians consented to this trafficking. Definitely, there is always consent otherwise we will be talking of kidnapping and abduction. Also most of the time there is also the consent of even the victim. However, there is something we must note here: the consent of the victim does not come into play when we want to try a case of human trafficking. If a child (under 18) is removed from home, we will not consider that you have all its consent while trying the case as trafficking. This is because that child or that adult in a vulnerable situation was not in the right frame of mind to take decision. If it was possible for that child to have an informed decision most likely it will not consent to the traffickers. We should know that these traffickers play on their victims; they will never tell you what you are getting into or what you will see there. There is always money to be made, a better living condition, and that is what they use luring their victims. If the traffickers ever told their victims the truth about the kind of things they are going to do or the kind of situation they are going to meet, you can be sure that most of the victims would not be their victims. The fact that there was deception, and may be use of force, show(s) that the decisions of the victims would have been affected. Since that decision was not well taken, we don’t really court the victims consent during the prosecution.

Can you estimate the number that fall victim to these human traffickers?
I wouldn’t want to talk about data because we must verify every data that is coming up, but I can tell you that the situation is rather endemic. There was a study conducted by UNICEF in 2002 before NAPTIP was set up. This study identified about three states around here as human traffic endemic state. The states are: Abia, Imo and Ebonyi. They were identified as states where many young people are taken away from their homes to another place within and outside the country. But that was before NAPTIP came in. When we were established we already had an idea that Imo, Abia and Ebonyi were endemic. It was when we started working that we found out that Enugu State also has its own peculiar problem in human trafficking issues; likewise Anambra State. And so we have since concluded that every state in this country is endemic in its own form. There is a form of human trafficking going on in every state. In this area, we can talk of trafficking in children. Taking our children our as domestic help, taking them in what we call “odibo” or apprenticeship, taking them out of the country and to other regions within the country. We can equally talk of sale of new born babies which is fast gaining an endemic proportion. All these are the different kinds of human trafficking that are found here. If we begin to delve into it we can talk about those who are breaking stones in Ebonyi State instead of being in school; those who are hawking during school hours; we talk about children who are used for begging when they should be exposed to education and recreation in proportion to their age. All these things are intertwined: they are abuses in children in the highest proportion. You see, we cannot pin these things to data. However, we can assure you that since we came in we have managed not less than three hundred and thirty (330) cases of victims as at December last year. And since January up till now we are still receiving victims and have quite number of cases already done, while some are still on-going. We have so many cases going on in the court right now. These are to show you the extent of human trafficking going on around here.

When we mention human trafficking there are some major countries that come to mind. So we would like to know the countries these victims are taken to?
You are talking about Italy. Well, the countries the victims are taken to depend on the purpose they are being trafficked. It is said that seventy percent of those in sex trade are blacks and about eighty percent of these blacks are from Nigeria. Most of our young girls who are trafficked for prostitution end up in Europe. You see them scattered all over Italy, Spain, Netherlands, even in Ireland. As we are speaking, there are some countries reporting that our girls-Nigerians- are in their countries. Trafficking is a worldwide thing. While talking about Nigerians leaving Nigeria, there are also Asians who leave Asia going into the same trade. So while some are moved out of Nigeria, some are moved into Nigeria. There are those who are used in drug trade. We have a lot of young people who are moved out of this country and sold into crime; some of them are the pick pockets. We have a lot of them taken into Holy Land. While others are going to Holy Land for spiritual exercise, these people are there to steal. They are moved and sent into Holy Land just for this purpose. These are mostly young men and ladies. Here in Nigeria, we have a lot of “kings” and madams who buy our young girls and put them into sex trade. There are also those who are trafficked for labour purposes. You talk about the young Nigerian children who end up in Mali, Gabon, who work in plantation in Cameroon, who end up in house help outside the country. There are those who also come into the country. You see a lot of people from Niger, Mali, Cameroon and others coming into Nigeria for work. These people were also recruited from their own country and brought into this place. Some years back NAPTIP with UNICEF and other agencies rescued many children in stone quarries in the South-west. Just within two years we have rescued some hundreds being moved across Nigeria. They were not Nigerians but were moving through Nigeria to Cameroon while somebody is waiting to receive them and reap out of their exploitation. The call to suppress human trafficking came from the United Nation (UN) because this ill is worldwide. Since it is a worldwide issue, UN came up with the Transnational Organized Crime Protocol in 2000. The protocol is what gave birth to what we have in Trafficking in Persons Act in Nigeria. In that protocol 2000, members of UN were encouraged to go home and domesticate the law. Nigeria as we said earlier, domesticated the law in 2003. This was sponsored by Chief Mrs. Atiku Abubaker in the National Assembly. It was eventually passed into law on 14th July 2003 and endorsed by the president. And with that, NAPTIP was set up primarily to replicate the Transnational Organized Crime Protocol which is fighting human trafficking. Other countries also have gone back to domesticate the protocol. Interestingly, Nigeria was one of the first countries to domesticate the protocol and eventually came up with an agency like this-NAPTIP. Other countries are more or less learning from us. So a good number of countries have started setting up agencies like this to administer their own domestic law against human trafficking.

From some of the points you just mentioned, there are various reasons for human trafficking.
Trafficking is done for different purposes. Some are trafficked for sexual exploitation: for prostitution, pornography and other sexual exploitations. Some are trafficked for stealing. Others are involved in hawking, labour, drug and other indecent activities. But in all, the interest of these human traffickers is to reap from another person’s exploitation. Many criminals have come into this trade. They know it is easy to manipulate these individuals and send them from where they begin to reap from their exploitation. They use the proceeds from the victims to fuel other crimes. The victims are used as arms and drug ventures, and for other petty jobs.

Do the victims receive the proceeds as well, or do the traffickers enjoy the whole proceed alone?
I would not know because I have not been a victim. From our interaction, definitely before they leave home they are promised some good pay, but on getting there you find a whole different arena. We have some victims we rescued few years back. Let me use it as a case study to show you what happens. These people were taken from Delta and Edo States to Ilorin for prostitution. When they were leaving home they were told that they were going to work in the supermarket or salon in Lagos, but on getting to Ilorin that became the end of their job. They were resold. The man that first took them from home sold them to another person for thirty thousand naira (N30, 000.00) each. When he received the money, he took ten thousand naira (N10, 000.00) back to each of the parents. The rest then became his and that was the end of their travel. They were exposed to men since the women bought them for a profit. This is her business, and so she made sure that for every man they met she collected the money. That is the scenario, that is how human trafficking works. Somebody has invested by buying them, they are somebody’s property and so the person expects to make good profits. She (the buyer) does not care about their (victims) welfare. And from everything we have seen, these girls are out in the streets everyday, even during winter or summer. No matter the condition they are expected to be on the street earning money for their buyer(s) or traffickers.

How do you rescue these victims to bring them back?
We work on report. When we have report we move into making arrests and rescue. We arrest both the traffickers and the victims. For those we rescued, we have homes for them where they are sheltered and counseled until they are stabilized to be integrated into the society again.

We know you must have some set-backs in your work. What are these set-backs?
We have a couple of them. First of all because the victims are traumatized, it is difficult for them to open up when you get at them. We have to go the extra mile to reassure them before they can open up. Ultimately any case we receive we try to prosecute. We are empowered to have a law which has given us power to prosecute the offender. To get complete justice for these people (victims), we try to prosecute the offenders. However, it becomes frustrating when the victims are not ready to open up for some fears. A lot of them are taken through oath before they commence their business and so they are afraid of the repercussions if they testify. You know it could be frustrating at times.
Funding is another difficulty. We get our funds from the government, and of course you know we cannot determine the number of the victims we will have in a day or per time. We might come out today and receive calls every other day about situations in one place or the other. And so for logistics, you have to run in; you have to try to make rescue and help the situations. All in all, I think we have cooperation of many people, well meaning people, and of course people know that we are working and are also giving us their support. Ultimately we need assistance.

Are there strategies you are employing to cub this nefarious act?
Well, our first strategy is public enlightenment. We must continue to tell people and talk to them about trafficking, and expose the trick of trafficking. We urge people not to jump into flimsy promises. We also tell people that they are their own chief security officers. You must be able to secure yourself. We equally tell people not to make themselves unnecessarily vulnerable, and of course you must work hard. Honesty and hardwork remain your best bet out of poverty. If you think that it is easier and better out there, wait until you get there. But if you work hard right here within our country you are going to make it. And of course you should shun crime and corruption. These are some of the things we do and tell people because we realize that ignorance is one of the causes of rise in human trafficking. When people are informed they are better of to protect themselves. Another factor that causes the increase in the human trafficking is greed. A parent giving out a ten year old child because he thinks he will earn some money or because they are going to receive a bag of rice and some wrappers at the end of the day is greedy. In so doing you are compromising the safety and well-being of your child for some flimsy promises. These are some of the strategies we have put in place. They are however, second to our belief that in prosecuting the offenders others will be deterred from getting into the same act.

Do you have any advice for the parents, guardians and the nation as a whole?
We urge people to shun these empty promises and greed, and be hardworking. We also want them to understand that there is nothing to gain by selling off their children. We talk to mothers to watch their daughters because the kind of reports and incidence we meet here suggest that women have lost it, we are not taking our duties as mothers serious. We see a situation where a girl, somebody’s daughter, gets pregnant and the mother wouldn’t know that the daughter was pregnant. Some will hide away for nine months to deliver and when they return home after delivery they would be accepted without caution. Some of those who hide go to the extent of giving out these children or selling them off. You see we must sit up, revalue our values and those things we were known for as a people: our pride and our dignity. There is dignity in labour. When we sit up to our responsibilities and revalue our values, pride and dignity, I am sure that half of our job will be done because many people will stop falling prey to human traffickers.